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Comments on: Loss of definition http://eatyourgreens.org.uk/archives/2006/09/loss_of_definit.html Actually, I am a rocket scientist Wed, 04 Feb 2015 23:54:43 +0000 hourly 1 https://wordpress.org/?v=5.1.19 By: Jim http://eatyourgreens.org.uk/archives/2006/09/loss_of_definit.html/comment-page-1#comment-48 Sun, 01 Oct 2006 16:22:58 +0000 http://eatyourgreens.org.uk/?p=57#comment-48 I thought about it a bit more, Bruce, and this goes beyond User Agents not supporting <dl> correctly. If I did use definition lists for that template, and used them properly, I wouldn’t be able to style it with CSS to look the way it’s supposed to look.

Problem is that I need a containing element around each heading and its values, so I can get them all to line up properly. <dl> doesn’t have a containing element that wraps around each <dt>,<dd> pair so it’s pretty much useless for the job anyway.

I read “won’t somebody please think of the gerbils” which made me feel better about not caring that I used a table.

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By: bruce http://eatyourgreens.org.uk/archives/2006/09/loss_of_definit.html/comment-page-1#comment-47 Sat, 30 Sep 2006 08:57:41 +0000 http://eatyourgreens.org.uk/?p=57#comment-47 Ah, Jim. This is the very quandry I find myself in at the moment.

One one hand, I agree with you. (Actually, it’s more like every other day, as my opinion flip-flops.) Why use object to bring Flasgh movies into a page, with all the attendant misery (and inaccessibility to JAWS) when good old (invalid) embed will do it perfectly?

On the other hand, I say that we shouldn’t compromise semantics because some User Agents don’t handle them well. After all, if we as a community hadn’t said “fuck the old browsers, we want to use CSS and the browser vendors will have to catch up”, we’d still be in spacer gif and nested table hell.

My acid test for myself is what I do about inpage links for IE (on which most assistive technology sits).

IE still breaks inpage links (and the latest IE7 did in my tests). I can’t bring myself to replace my semantic <div id=”jumpToHere”> with the much more accessible [to broken Internet Explorer], but semantically less clear:

<dspan style=”position:absolute;”>
<da name=”jumpToHere” id=”jumpToHere”> <d/a>
<d/span>
(See http://www.jimthatcher.com/news.htm)

I *can* however, bring myself to write the semantic but invalid
<ddiv id=”jumpToHere” tabindex=”-1″>.

(See http://juicystudio.com/article/ie-keyboard-navigation.php)

But it leaves a bad taste in my mouth.

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